Steppin’ Out of Babylon: Podcast-Radio Interviews by Sue Supriano

“Babylon” is the “isms” and “schisms” not only within the system but within ourselves. Let's organize, unify and step out of Babylon.



Sue Supriano’s Steppin’ Out of Babylon is a radio interview series covering a broad range of important issues in today’s world: peace and war, human and civil rights, communication, the media, the environment, food security, racism, globalization, immigration and matters of the spirit. Over 250 shows are available at this site!



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David Bacon

Award-winning photojournalist, labor organizer, immigrant rights activist and author. His most recent book is Illegal People- How Globalization Creates Migration & Criminalizes Immigrants

Play Audio.
TRT: 27:30
Date: 2009-03-23

David Bacon explains that what the US government and the governments of other rich industrialized countries do through their actions and policies towards poorer and developing countries is, in fact, designed to benefit the economies and large corporations of those “developed” countries and that these actions and policies often lead to what he refers to as “forced migration”. The policies of the IMF (International Monetary Fund) and NAFTA (North American Free Trade Agreement) are terrible for working people of poor countries. In fact, the workers in both North and South America lost out with NAFTA. Workers in the U.S. lost when 800 jobs went to Mexico and Mexico lost a million jobs. Another way in which NAFTA creates poverty, for example, is that it allows U.S. corporations such as the huge food corporation of Archer Daniel Midlands to dump its products on the Mexican market at a very low price thus undercutting the price of local corn that has been grown by small farmers for centuries. As a result the local corn farmers have to go elsewhere to get money to feed their families. They often migrate to cities, to the U.S. and to the maquilladores --factories along the U.S.-Mexican border, which pay little and often mistreat workers. From 1994 when NAFTA went into effect until now about six million people have come to the U.S. from Mexico because there was no other way for their families to survive. Corporations want this flow of “cheap labor” because they profit from it but they want it in a certain controlled way in which people leave if they aren’t working and have no rights while they do work in the U.S. Twelve million people are now in the U.S. without visas and therefore have no political or labor rights, which is what “Illegal” means -- that one is without rights and can be controlled. The same was true for the Chinese, Japanese and Filipino immigrants of the past. Notice as well the inherent racism. The stereotypes of “illegal” people are overwhelmingly people of color. The Real ID Act and the Patriot Act legislate that working outside of federal recruitment plans mean one will go to prison, as thousands of people do. There is a court in Tucson, Arizona where so-called “illegals” are brought in wearing chains, and then approximately seventy people a day from this group go to federal prison, thus making an example of them for the others. Local police and immigrations authorities work together—e.g., police set up roadblocks looking for driver’s licenses in the attempt to identify and arrest immigrants.

To contact David Bacon:

Recorded in February 2009


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December 26, 2015

In memory:

Sue, who lived an amazing life from 1938 - 2015.